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The Verde Independent | Cottonwood, Arizona

home : opinions : opinions August 28, 2014

4/1/2014 2:05:00 PM
Letter: We can only assume that ...


Camp Soaring Eagle has proposed to purchase and rezone the Living Water property in Cornville to PAD designation from residential zoning. They propose to operate a children's camp on the site, to conduct fundraising events, and to rent the camp out to others to help fund the purchase and operation. After three Citizen Awareness Meetings and much discussion the lack of specific information makes it difficult to assess the impact that such a change will have on the quiet residential nature off the community.

At the last CSE meeting with the Cornville P&Z Committee, CSE representatives were specifically asked to provide accurate estimates of the total number of events of all types and the calandarized distribution of those events. Their most recent revision to their LOI of 3/21/2014 gave some of the requested information but gave no summary and no distribution.

They did, however, provide minimal numerical data to allow one to create a possible distribution of their proposed events and the number of participants at those events with some assumptions:

• The number of events of each type and the maximum number of persons on site to support them are correct and will be enforced.

• The LOI fails to recognize the types and numbers of logistical, maintenance, support and service personnel to support those events. We have made some educated estimates of the numbers of those people.

• We have assumed most events will be conducted in the more temperate months of March through October.

• The LOI states that of the 10 third party events some will be 7-day and some will be one or two days. We have assumed CSE Camping Weeks will take precedence allowing only two 3rd party camping weeks (when school is out).

• We have reduced the number of Fundraiser participants from 300 to 150 for scalability of the charts.

• We have reduced the number of third-party participant from a max of 300 to 100, again for scalability.

• The LOI makes no allowance for the work and time involved in cleaning, supply, and set up for events, nor the tear down, cleaning and resupply.

Our conclusions lead us to these estimates of activity days per year:

• Event Days: 155

• Set up and supply days: 75

• Cleanup and resupply: 75

• Total Activity Days: 305 days per year

• Total people on site per year: 22,633

Robert Hoffman


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Reader Comments

Posted: Friday, April 4, 2014
Article comment by: Spin Stopper

I'm pleased to see that CSE has made the concession of reducing the maximum number of people per day for any event from 300 to 120. Perhaps the Hoffman analysis had a good result.

Despite this concession in the 2015 CSE Calendar of Uses. Their logic is faulty and incomplete. Perhaps by simple lack of analysis, or perhaps by desire to spin the data in their favor. We'll give them the benefit of the doubt.

A gross error in logic still persists, however. They erroneously list the number of persons per event, add them up and state that there will only be 1816 people on site for the year. They fail to factor in how long each event will be.

Their calendar lists the planned events and the number of people that may attend each event, and they then state the number of days each event will last. ONE MORE COLUMN IS NEEDED TO COMPLETE THE PICTURE. SPECIFICALLY, THEY SHOULD HAVE A COLUMN TITLED:" TOTAL PEOPLE DAYS".

TOTAL PEOPLE DAYS = Number of Persons per event X Number of Days for the event. For example, A Summer Camp Program event hosting 68 people for 6 days = 408 People Days.

If you do this for all events and then total the column you will see the true number of people days on site for the year. In the case of the new CSE Calendar this equals 6,865 activity days in 2015.

Once again, however, it must be pointed out that the CSE numbers do not include maintenance, stable, pool, gardening, admin, kitchen, or housekeeping staff. They also fail to recognize that delivery and set up is required before each event, and cleanup is required after each event. These all add People Days on site. bringing the total back into the realm presented by Mr. Hoffman.

Posted: Thursday, April 3, 2014
Article comment by: Clarice Christian

If one has been attending the meetings 3 community meetings and 2 Cornville P&Z meetings one would know that Camp Soaring Eagle has been listening to the community and have revised their application to mitigate neighbors concerns and to clarify certain points of the project.

The letter to the Editor submitted by Mr. Hoffman is not factual and it seems since CSE is mitigating their concerns, which any good applicant would, Mr. Hoffman and a few others seem to feel that by spreading untruths this will garner more support for their cause.

Well here are the facts about the estimated activities each year based on the meeting this evening.

Number of days used per year for all proposed uses = 91 out of 365 days not 305 days! BIG DIFFERENCE

Number of people based on the aforementioned uses throughout the year = 1,816 not 22,633. BIG DIFFERENCE Mr. Hoffman.

The traffic summary shows a 50% traffic reduction compared to its current use of a Church Retreat that has been there for 33 years!

A calendar was distributed this evening showing a breakdown of each use as requested by the Cornville P&Z Committee and community members attending the meetings.

From my stand point, the applicants have done everything we, the Cornville Community, has asked for and more!

The problem is this: Not In My Backyard and change for most is unsettling. Many have moved to this beautiful area and if you look at Cornville it is diverse in its uses and I for one support this use.

Look at the cover of the Cornville Community Plan. Someone thought the picture of the retreat was beautiful and the individuals who created the community plan thought it would make a great cover photo!

Posted: Thursday, April 3, 2014
Article comment by: Frank Lee Confused

In our county, so called, "non profit" organizations can do unlimited business...tax free. So called, charities accept donations and purchase more land which magically becomes property tax free.

It becomes difficult to distinguish the charity work from the business, all the while, the county shifts the tax burden to "residents" who pay for county services for these free loading businesses.

The second largest "charitable" organization in Yavapai county is the Tao Fellowship Corporation (who have fooled the Assesor into believing they are a religion). They accept $millions in donations each year and do no charity work. Apparently, these scams are legal.

Posted: Wednesday, April 2, 2014
Article comment by: John Davis

Allowing the Religious Living Water Use was something the county had no choice in years ago. That is the Law then and now. Today however this is a different animal as it is a for profit business in a residential zone. A permanent PAD commercial use application. Shouldn't the County just give a Use PERMIT requiring residential support with a time limit to prove it is compatible and doesn't over commercialize that part of Cornville??

Posted: Wednesday, April 2, 2014
Article comment by: Adjoining Property

Mr. Hoffman's graph was spot on and a graphic illustration of the impact on our area. I know he submitted it with his letter. You should have printed it.

Posted: Wednesday, April 2, 2014
Article comment by: Margaret Gardiner

I, for one, living directly across from the proposed 'camp' property, can only assume that the peace and quiet I have grown to love here will be forever disturbed if all this comes to pass, NO MATTER WHAT the Camp Soaring Eagle people say.

Posted: Wednesday, April 2, 2014
Article comment by: Mark Brady

The Hoffman article is first class work and most accurately presents the facts of utilization that CSEF LOI, as revised, does not state and cares to simply minimize these facts. It would have been nice if graph of these facts had been published as well

Posted: Wednesday, April 2, 2014
Article comment by: Concerned Neighbor

This is an excellent and disturbing analysis of the "data" , such as it is, provided by CSE.

Cornville Community Association planning and zoning committee members, county P and Z members, and County Supervisors, PLEASE take note in your decision making process before allowing this change.

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